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Originally posted by Aprosenf: **I've already proven this wrong. I released EVNEW with no warning whatsoever. I wanted it to be a surprise of happiness to the sullen world of Windows users who wanted to make plugs but couldn't, and that's exactly what happened.
**
EVNEW != plugin. As a curiousity, were you the only developer of EVNEW?
When am I releasing my plugin? Maybe after I get some free time. Spending your time cramming for a 1600 on the SAT I and then 5 AP tests during sophomore year is not the most pleasant experience nor does it provide for much free time. I am fully aware of the fact that people don't have that much time to work on something as massive as a TC plugin. I've just noticed that plugin's still aren't appearing and after beating Nova and Polycon in too short of a time, I'm bored. ;-).
The recent teasers plug of SFA released is not indicative of major process. It looks interesting but the last ST plug also went done even with much of it finished excluding the missions and some bugs. BTW, have you heard of Mille Terrae. I was beta-testing it when it was mostly complete. AFAIK, it's vaporware. It was never finished even though it was very much done. (Although, a reason for its demise was the release of Nova.)
In addition, I would agree with Bomb on why it takes so few plug-in's are finished. I really think the completion of graphics is the key milestone. Graphics artists are not the most common and being able to keep them onboard and finish the graphics demonstrates that the team is cohesive and that the majority of the work is finished. Mission and planet descriptions are fast, graphics are not.
------------------ "Veni, Vidi, Vici" "I came, I saw, I conqeured." Julius Caeser
I want to get my TC out the door, really I do. It's taking time, is all. A lot of time.
For me, my setback is perfectionism. When I look back at what I created in the past, especially in terms of writing, I'm quite embarrassed. I've come so far in life since I last did any solid plug-working, my current "vision" no longer even remotely resembles what it used to be. In a professional setting, deadlines serve to counter this problem. However, as long as my project is my own personal (not professional) thing, I'm not likely to release anything until I'm satisfied. Thus I've been "in the works" for several years.
Taking long breaks in development is what really kills me here. I lose momentum, and when I look over what I accomplished, I feel like scrapping it all and starting over. It's my curse, and I know I'm not alone.
------------------ - o n y x - "I dn't type. I'm a kybard artist " (url="http://"http://www.pacifier.com/~kkey/shipyard/index.html")Onyx's EV Shipyard(/url)
I have huge numbers of descs, ideas, and even a galactic map made up for my TC... it was going to be for EVO, but then I decided that it had to be Nova or nothing, as that's where the audience is.
But over the last few months my enthusiasm for it has waned... it's never going to be a TC anywhere near the size, innovation or polish of Sephil Saga or SFA, and at this rate those plugs will be out before mine anyway. It all comes down to the fact that I do not want to share the work. I intend to make the plugin in a fully completed state with placeholder graphics, then seek a graphic artist to do the ships for it... but in terms of programming and writing I want it to be all my own work.
We'll have to see if The Resurgence ever actually gets anywhere.
------------------ (url="http://"http://www.mazca.com/")Mazca(/url) , Moderator, (url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/cgi-bin/ubb/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number;=9&SUBMIT;=Go&urgaylol;=yes")EV Developer's Corner(/url) burn burn the truth, enjoy the flames in celebration
Actually the Frozen Heart 2 TC could be released tomorrow.
But it won't be because I haven't yet ported Femme Fatale or finished writing (let alone begun testing) the next instalment.
I want to release the trilogy in one go. Otherwise, it's just a graphical upgrade on FH 1, and (despite what everyone may say) who is really interested in just a graphical upgrade?
------------------ M A R T I N • T U R N E R (url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/cgi-bin/vftp/show.pl?product=evo&category;=plugins&display;=downloads&file;=FrozenHeart104.sit.bin")Frozen Heart(/url) (url="http://"http://www.AmbrosiaSW.com/cgi-bin/vftp/show.pl?product=evo&category;=plugins&display;=downloads&file;=FemmeFatale.sea.bin")Femme Fatale(/url) (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/cgi-bin/vftp/dl-redirect.pl?path=evo/plugins&file;=Frozen Heart - the No.hqx")Frozen Heart - the Novel(/url)
Originally posted by zhouj: The recent teasers plug of SFA released is not indicative of major process.
If you're referring to the teaser I posted on the ASW boards, that's all it was -- a teaser. I've since made the complete alpha release available a number of times for limited downloads, and a number of people have it. The only thing that's keeping me from calling it a storyline-free beta at this time is the number of dëscs that need to be written.
Of course, there's a crapload of those to write still.
------------------ Starfleet Adventures: A Star Trek TC for EVN (url="http://"http://www.ev-nova.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=145") Discussion Board (/url) Starfleet Adventures (url="http://"http://www.ev-nova.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=71")Progress Log(/url) denki's Starfleet Adventures (url="http://"http://www.geocities.com/starfleet_adventures/")FAQ page(/url) It is better to feed the goat than it is today.
Originally posted by Martin Turner: **I want to release the trilogy in one go. Otherwise, it's just a graphical upgrade on FH 1, and (despite what everyone may say) who is really interested in just a graphical upgrade? **
Well, a ton of people downloaded MAGMA didn't they? Graphical updates are cool, but I'd be willing to wait for a simultaneous release.
Matrix
------------------ "Nothing is fool-proof to a sufficiently talented fool." (url="http://"http://htf.mondominishows.com/valentine/main.asp?seed=7375&serial;=214877")The funniest valentine I've ever gotten.(/url)
Originally posted by Martin Turner: **Actually the Frozen Heart 2 TC could be released tomorrow.
Like I said, it's your art, so it's your choice. Still....
The answer to "who is really interested...." is: lots of people. Between PC users and those mac users who own EVN but not EVO or EVC, there are literally thousands of people who would be thrilled to get their hands on FH 1, even if it is just a "graphical upgrade."
This is not pure speculation -- I'm actually in something of a position to know (for once). The Nova-ized version of Captain Skyblade's Cold Fusion, which is nothing but new graphics for a pre-existing scenario (the EVO universe), has had over 1650 downloads from the ASW add-ons page in just a couple of months, plus an unknown number of additional downloads from my web page. Not that I'm disinterested, but people seem to like it....
------------------ (url="http://"http://home.comcast.net/~drtrowel/")Dr. Trowel's E.S.W.P.(/url) -- Featuring Cold Fusion Graphics for EVN Override, and an EVN/O outfit bug fix. Very Good Stuff: (url="http://"http://ev-nova.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2832&sid;=43627ead61761e7f19060b00c14c739c")Big Nova FAQ(/url) (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/cgi-bin/ubb/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number;=31&SUBMIT;=Go")Bomb's Plug-in Guide(/url) (url="http://"http://www.evula.com/escape_velocity/")EVula's Lair(/url) (url="http://"http://w00tware.ev-nova.net/")NovaTools(/url) Interests: The Good, The Bad, and The Loopy.
Actually the Frozen Heart 2 TC could be released tomorrow. But it won't be because I haven't yet ported Femme Fatale or finished writing (let alone begun testing) the next instalment.
Well, I never played the original, and I have heard only good things about it, so I wouldn't mind.
------------------ ATTs Official Newb. Dammit. (url="http://"mailto:lotsofblackflags@yahoo.com")mailto:lotsofblackflags@yahoo.com(/url)lotsofblackflags@yahoo.com
Originally posted by Martin Turner: Actually the Frozen Heart 2 TC could be released tomorrow.
I held my breath by this sentence.
I can wait for your plug, Martin.
------------------ (url="http://"http://en.wikipedia.org")En Wikipedia(/url)
Originally posted by lotsofblackflags: **Well, I never played the original, and I have heard only good things about it, so I wouldn't mind.
Same here - theres alot of new blood in the Nova community that wasnt around in the days of EVO. -Az
------------------ It is here. EVNEW Public Beta (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW(/url) Stuffit is a piece of .sit.
Yes Frozen Heart would be new to me as well. As was said there are a lot of us that never had the originals.
------------------ Nothing like the smell of burnt rubber in the morning. - Now let's see some Tiresmoke! (url="http://"http://www.rsdg.net")www.rsdg.net(/url)
Originally posted by Mazca: **I have huge numbers of descs, ideas, and even a galactic map made up for my TC... it was going to be for EVO, but then I decided that it had to be Nova or nothing, as that's where the audience is.
But over the last few months my enthusiasm for it has waned... it's never going to be a TC anywhere near the size, innovation or polish of Sephil Saga or SFA, and at this rate those plugs will be out before mine anyway. It all comes down to the fact that I do not want to share the work.
I know how you feel Mazca, I thought I had some really good ideas for my TC, and then I hear of some of the brilliant things added in Sephil Saga, and they seem lame. I compare it to the size of SFA, and it seems pathetic.
I thought about trying to recruit a team (A graphics artist trying to recruit coders, who would have thought it!) But I don't feel I could handle not being in complete, 100% creative control over the project all the time. So at the moment, it's still my baby.
I think many people would be extremely interested in this graphical upgrade, but I think releasing it as a complete trilogy is the better Idea.
------------------ "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." - Mark Twain.
Originally posted by TheRedeemer: I compare it to the size of SFA, and it seems pathetic.
Please don't. If anything, I think the size of SFA is pathetic -- what the hell was I thinking, trying to make it so close to canon? I'm a freakin' idiot, and if you don't agree with me, then feel free to help me research and write these 1000+ spöb dëscs.
Originally posted by TheRedeemer: **I know how you feel Mazca, I thought I had some really good ideas for my TC, and then I hear of some of the brilliant things added in Sephil Saga, and they seem lame. I compare it to the size of SFA, and it seems pathetic. **
You shouldn't ever let other people's projects intimidate you, Redeemer. Ultimately, a plug is not dependant on it's technical prowess or it's size. Those are just features like anything else. A good plug is good because it has heart, because it's been lovingly crafted by it's creator. A plug, I've found, is very similar to forging a Japanese sword- the smith puts part of his own soul into the work. I know it probably sounds cheezy, but it's true. As others have mentioned, it's art. If it's a quality peice, people will love it, regardless of it's features.
------------------ ~Charlie Sephil Saga Homepage: (url="http://"http://www.cwssoftware.com")www.cwssoftware.com(/url)
Originally posted by Masamune: **You shouldn't ever let other people's projects intimidate you, Redeemer. Ultimately, a plug is not dependant on it's technical prowess or it's size. Those are just features like anything else. A good plug is good because it has heart, because it's been lovingly crafted by it's creator. A plug, I've found, is very similar to forging a Japanese sword- the smith puts part of his own soul into the work. I know it probably sounds cheezy, but it's true. As others have mentioned, it's art. If it's a quality peice, people will love it, regardless of it's features.
What you've said is very true, It's not just cool feature uses that makes a game. But however, If someone's just played Sephil Saga (or any other TC), and has got used to all the cool little features, and then goes onto another TC, which hasn't got all the cool little features, It might be a little disappointing. It woulden't make it unplayable, but you'd always have at the back of your mind 'in the other TC, they would of used this feature here etc'
Does anyone get what I mean?
Originally posted by TheRedeemer: **What you've said is very true, It's not just cool feature uses that makes a game. But however, If someone's just played Sephil Saga (or any other TC), and has got used to all the cool little features, and then goes onto another TC, which hasn't got all the cool little features, It might be a little disappointing. It woulden't make it unplayable, but you'd always have at the back of your mind 'in the other TC, they would of used this feature here etc'
I am not so sure I agree there. As I have stated before I come from a SIM Racing background. In that there are certainly more mods than exist here or even in the past of EV. There are people that actually collect and play all those mods. While there is always some complaints that one mod or another could have used features other mods have, that does not seem an overall factor on why people seem to like one mod more than another. Whew that was a long run on sentance. HeHe
People tend to have favorites due to a series or charactor or sometimes just a favorite team that they follow. I think that the same will hold true here. It is not about features as much as it is what people will like. That should certainly detract from using features either. However it can be storyline elements or graphics or any issue really that can make something not only playable but popular.
Of course something that is poorly writen and lacks good graphics or features will likely get lost in a crowd. Keep in mind though that there certainly is no crowd at the moment. Just the same if you put yourself into something and do the best you can then there will be folks that will appreciate the effort.
Just my two cents worth.
Does anyone get what I mean? **
As long as the designer's choices are well articulated and the project as a whole is cohesive, I would think this would be seen more as using a different section of the engine to great effect. The Nova engine has a whole lot to offer, but you need only use what you truly require. To ignore a plug because, say, it has no submunitioning weapons, would be cheating yourself out of some potentially solid gaming experiences.
That said, I'm usually skeptical of projects which seek to encompass the entire engine, because I wince at the possibility of gimmicks just to use some far-flung feature.
Originally posted by Onyx: That said, I'm usually skeptical of projects which seek to encompass the entire engine, because I wince at the possibility of gimmicks just to use some far-flung feature.
This is the exact reason that I don't like the PlugPack outfits very much. I agree wholeheartedly.
------------------ (url="http://"http://fenris.ma.cx/forum")Fenris(/url)
Originally posted by Tiresmoke: Of course something that is poorly writen and lacks good graphics or features will likely get lost in a crowd.
UE Patriot has proved you wrong there...
Moving on, I agree that using every feature for the sake of using every feature is stupid. While I plan to use a number of features for atmosphere, I find that there are many I can't find a use for. Thus, I likely won't be using them.
------------------ The programmer's code of entomology: there's always another bug. Windows users: stop asking for plugins. (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW/")Make one yourself.(/url) (url="http://"http://www.cwssoftware.com")Sephil Saga Website(/url)
Remember, just because you make a plugin,it doesn't mean you have to release it. I think people should take a moment to ask themselves why they are making their plugin. Ego? Trust me, making game mods is not the way to boost your ego. No matter how good your plugin is, no matter how many engine limits it shatters or new features it takes advantage of, there will always be a lot of people who will hate it. Are you making it to build your resume? I will admit, this is a good reason to build a plugin, but Nova is not exactly the game engine you should be developing for if this is your goal, most people seem to ignore game material that is not 3D. If you are making a plugin for fun though, releasing it is not a prerequisite for you to have fun building it. By not treating a plugin as something you are going to release, you can easily ignore that little voice in your head that says "UberPluginX has 1000 systems so mine needs to have that many too." and instead make a plugin that fits your vision. And when you have something playable, something you could put into beta, then you can look at the current plugin climate. Maybe the huge plugin you thought yours would not match up to never came out. Maybe it did, but the players are still chomping at the bit for more. Either way, at the end of the day, you will have made a plugin you like , and you will have enjoyed making it.
------------------ 68K Mac Liberation Army-- 22 Macs Liberated. (url="http://"http://www.evula.org/anubis/index.html")Polycon EV(/url), a total conversion for EV Nova. (url="http://"http://www.ev-nova.net/forums/viewforum.php?f=20")Polycon EV Fourm(/url)