Are there any plans for a .rez-> mac converter for pc (or emulated mac)

mrxak

Is there anybody that knows how I can convert .rez -> Mac on my Mac?

Azratax2

Woah. Hmm. David Arthur's converter complains that everything except the nova data files that I feed it isnt a valid rez file. This is not good.
-Az

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It is here. EVNEW Public Beta (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW(/url)

AriosSw

Quote

Originally posted by mrxak:
**Is there anybody that knows how I can convert .rez - > Mac on my Mac?

**

RezConv, my upcoming converter will do just that. (It will do the conversion both ways - just launch, click convert, select a file, and boom, it will convert to the opposite) the app is currently in final testing - .rez to Mac works flawlessly but I am having some minor difficulties with Mac to .rez:

The .rez files it writes can be opened and edited perfectly with EVNEW, but PC Nova refuses to load them. Do you know if there is some sort of checksum that Nova does on the files?

Edit: Here's a screenshot.

Posted Image

The interface was so simple I had to add a picture Arggh, I just realized the button isn't exactly centered. That will be fixed.

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(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com")Arios SoftWare(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/products/evone/")EVONE 1.0pb2 - the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)

(This message has been edited by AriosSw (edited 11-16-2003).)

Aprosenf

Quote

Originally posted by AriosSw:
**The .rez files it writes can be opened and edited perfectly with EVNEW, but PC Nova refuses to load them. Do you know if there is some sort of checksum that Nova does on the files?
**

Does debuglog.txt contain "...failed or has no resource fork" when Nova is loading the plugins? If so, then the likely answer is that you have some bad byte values somewhere. It took me a while to get all the byte values calculated exactly right to have Nova be able to load plugins created by EVNEW. EVNEW is more flexible than Nova in that it can read .rez files as long as the more important byte values are correct. Check out the source code for some inspiration, particularly CPlugIn.cpp.

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Get (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")EVNEW(/url) - the free, open-source plugin EVN Editor for Windows!

mrxak

Quote

Originally posted by AriosSw:
< snip>

Will it be free, or shareware?

cdrcoyote

Quote

Originally posted by AriosSw:
I am working on a drag and drop FREEWARE converter that will do both Mac- >Windows and Windows->Mac. A fully functional version should be out soon (but I don't dare give dates). Since there is no official code to do the conversions, I can't promise it will work on every plug right off the bat, but any and all problems will of course be fixed as they are reported.

I think that answers your question mrxak.

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http://www.cdrwerks.com
Home of the EVula Plug.

AriosSw

Quote

Originally posted by Aprosenf:
**Does debuglog.txt contain "...failed or has no resource fork" when Nova is loading the plugins? If so, then the likely answer is that you have some bad byte values somewhere. It took me a while to get all the byte values calculated exactly right to have Nova be able to load plugins created by EVNEW. EVNEW is more flexible than Nova in that it can read .rez files as long as the more important byte values are correct. Check out the source code for some inspiration, particularly CPlugIn.cpp.

**

Yes, that is the error I get - an incredibly unhelpful one. Thanks for the offer. I have looked through your source and am comparing our write algorithms. Using the Mac app HexEdit, I am doing byte-for-byte comparisons on our outputs of the same plug and they are basically identical. The header, all the way to the resource.map line, is identical in both files. The only differences are in the actual resources themselves where we are writing out random memory as filler in text fields.

Anyway, I will continue to play with it and let you know of any problems.

BTW, mrxak, cdrcoyote is correct in his answer. It will be released for free as soon as I get this algorithm straightened out.

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(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com")Arios SoftWare(/url)
(url="http://"http://www.ariossoftware.com/products/evone/")EVONE 1.0pb2 - the plugin editor for EV/EVO/EVN(/url)

mrxak

Quote

Originally posted by cdrcoyote:
**I think that answers your question mrxak.

**

Thanks.

Entarus

I can now confirm that we have solved the Mac to .Rez problems with RezConv and it now converts plug-ins both ways flawlessly.

Look forward to a release soon.

Entarus,

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cdrcoyote

Quote

Originally posted by AriosSw:
BTW, mrxak, cdrcoyote is correct in his answer. It will be released for free as soon as I get this algorithm straightened out.

I hope I am since I quoted you.

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http://www.cdrwerks.com
Home of the EVula Plug.

mrxak

(url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/webboard/Forum9/HTML/004825.html")Ta-da!(/url)

Cunjo

I figured i would revive this old topic instead of starting a new one on the same subject. As a plugin developer that uses a PC, i need a way of converting .rez files to the Macintosh format before I upload them to the addons. is there a mac emulator for windows XP out there that i could use for this? or is there such a program that will run on a PC? I want to be able to offer my plugins to mac users freely without having to worry about technical difficulties on the other end. seeing is how the vast majority of EVN users run a MAC OS, i was wondering if such a thing would be feasable.

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A warrior can shape himself to suit anything in the universe.
A master can shape the universe to suit himself.

Azratax2

Quote

Originally posted by Cunjo:
**I figured i would revive this old topic instead of starting a new one on the same subject. As a plugin developer that uses a PC, i need a way of converting .rez files to the Macintosh format before I upload them to the addons. is there a mac emulator for windows XP out there that i could use for this? or is there such a program that will run on a PC? I want to be able to offer my plugins to mac users freely without having to worry about technical difficulties on the other end. seeing is how the vast majority of EVN users run a MAC OS, i was wondering if such a thing would be feasable.

**

an old 68k mac which will run OS 7.6 or even 8.1 if you can get it cna be emulated easilly.

You need:
Basilisk II mac emulator
OS 7.6 (which is publicly available from apple.com). Since David Arthur just fixed MPC, we should be able to convert on sub-X systems (since RezConv only works on X, despite Arios' claims to the conterary).
HFV Explorer (to move files to and from emulated mac)
David Arthur's MPC 1.01
Finally, you need a mac rom (this can only be had legally if you own the (very old) comp you will be emulating. Hopefully, you have in the past owned an old mac (or can dig one out of the trash somewhere - it doenst have to work, just has to be a pre-ppc mac), and can then search the web for it's rom image. The best one I have seen on the web is for a centris 650 (which I actually once had, before it stopped booting))

This should work together. I think I will make a setup like this, test it, and then roll everything but the rom together and put it up for download somewhere. Since everything but the rom is publicly available, this shouldnt be a problem.
-Az

------------------
It is here. EVNEW Public Beta (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW(/url)
Stuffit is a piece of .sit.

(This message has been edited by Azratax2 (edited 02-10-2004).)

seant

Quote

Originally posted by Azratax2:
**
I do not want a situation in which mac EVN users are forced to go through the same sort of s*** that us PC users have had to in order ot use plugs.
**

From where I stand, if the PC port had been done in such a way as to use .rsrc text files vs .rez, these conversion problems wouldn't exist.

To head off people: yes, rsrc is a resource format. Yes, PCs don't use resource forks. It is possible to move the entire resource fork into the data fork, however.

See (url="http://"http://www.ambrosiasw.com/webboard/Forum26/HTML/014363.html")http://www.ambrosias...TML/014363.html(/url) for a old discussion on the matter.

Regulus summed it up quite well when he said, "I agree that this state of affairs is criminally stupid."

-STH

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"Create enigmas, not explanations." -Robert Smithson

(This message has been edited by seant (edited 02-10-2004).)

Azratax2

Quote

Originally posted by seant:
** <seant grumbles about it idiocy of the PC version being made to use .rez vs just writing a .rsrc parser>

From where I stand, if the PC port had been done in such a way as to use .rsrc text files vs .rez, these conversion problems wouldn't exist.

To head off people: yes, rsrc is a resource format. Yes, PCs don't use resource forks. It is possible to move the entire resource fork into the data fork, however.

See http://www.ambrosiasw.com/webboard/Forum26...TML/014363.html for a old discussion on the matter.

Regulus summed it up quite well when he said, "I agree that this state of affairs is criminally stupid."

-STH

**

.rsrc (macbinary encoded) files, are corrupted by emailing and by many other common transmission methods (If I upload and download a .rsrc to/from a server via ftp, for example, it will be destroyed in the process). Not only that, but that still wouldnt solve the big problem for users dealing with plugins (that they dont decompress under pcstuffit 8), and would actually complicate the distribution of PC usable plugs (due to the tendoncy of .rsrc's to get corrupted). What about the fact that stuffit randomly chooses wheather to use a .rsc, .rsrc, .bin or no extension for the decompressed plugs?
Although the .rez format causes problems, the .rsrc format as it stands would also cause even more problems, so contraband had to make a PC plugin format different from a simple macbinary encoded plug with a .rsrc extension. I suspect they already had a parser and converter for the .rez resource format , and they thus used that.
.rsrc wouldnt be any nicer, and wouldn propably be worse for most users.
Besides, the s*** to which i reffered to was the challenge of getting a working .rsrc or extensionless file that converts anyway out of a stuffit compressed plugin, not the act of dragging and dropping a file onto the converter - so it wouldnt be any easier for the average user.
-Az

------------------
It is here. EVNEW Public Beta (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW(/url)
Stuffit is a piece of .sit.

(This message has been edited by Azratax2 (edited 02-10-2004).)

Cunjo

Quote

Originally posted by Azratax2:
**

Quote

Originally posted by Cunjo:
**I figured i would revive this old topic instead of starting a new one on the same subject. As a plugin developer that uses a PC, i need a way of converting .rez files to the Macintosh format before I upload them to the addons. is there a mac emulator for windows XP out there that i could use for this? or is there such a program that will run on a PC? I want to be able to offer my plugins to mac users freely without having to worry about technical difficulties on the other end. seeing is how the vast majority of EVN users run a MAC OS, i was wondering if such a thing would be feasable.

**

an old 68k mac which will run OS 7.6 or even 8.1 if you can get it cna be emulated easilly.

You need:
Basilisk II mac emulator
OS 7.6 (which is publicly available from apple.com). Since David Arthur just fixed MPC, we should be able to convert on sub-X systems (since RezConv only works on X, despite Arios' claims to the conterary).
HFV Explorer (to move files to and from emulated mac)
David Arthur's MPC 1.01
Finally, you need a mac rom (this can only be had legally if you own the (very old) comp you will be emulating. Hopefully, you have in the past owned an old mac (or can dig one out of the trash somewhere - it doenst have to work, just has to be a pre-ppc mac), and can then search the web for it's rom image. The best one I have seen on the web is for a centris 650 (which I actually once had, before it stopped booting))

This should work together. I think I will make a setup like this, test it, and then roll everything but the rom together and put it up for download somewhere. Since everything but the rom is publicly available, this shouldnt be a problem.
-Az

**

you think i could find a rom for a IIci? or is that considered ppc? i have one... somewhere... and what converter do i get that will work on OS7/ OS8?

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A warrior can shape himself to suit anything in the universe.
A master can shape the universe to suit himself.

Azratax2

Quote

Originally posted by Cunjo:
**you think i could find a rom for a IIci? or is that considered ppc? i have one... somewhere... and what converter do i get that will work on OS7/ OS8?

**

Thats Way older than it needs to be. Proforma's with ###s having 3 digits, Centrises, Quadras, and that era are propably better choices. I dont know if you can run OS 7.6 on something as old as an emulated IIci. Google for the rom image.
Mac Plugin Converter 1.01, posted in the undoc features thread (would post link, but i cant seem to paste anything at the moment) will work on 8.1, and propably 7.6.
-Az

------------------
It is here. EVNEW Public Beta (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW(/url)
Stuffit is a piece of .sit.

Cunjo

don't know about the emulator, but my old IIci was running 8.something when the harddrive finally keeled over.

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A warrior can shape himself to suit anything in the universe.
A master can shape the universe to suit himself.

Azratax2

Quote

Originally posted by Cunjo:
**don't know about the emulator, but my old IIci was running 8.something when the harddrive finally keeled over.

**

Cool. Guess that means it will work.
-Az

------------------
It is here. EVNEW Public Beta (url="http://"http://www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW")www.aznt.com/EVN/EVNEW(/url)
Stuffit is a piece of .sit.

Regulus

Azratax, I think you misunderstand.

An old-style file with a resource fork and no data fork, such as a Macintosh EVN plug-in, will indeed be stripped of its entire resource fork when be transferred across single-fork systems (ie, most UNIX systems, including ftps and mailservers. NTFS, however will preserve multi-fork files)

A ".rsrc" file is not a file of this nature, however. It is a "flat" (single fork) file, which has had the entire contents of its resource fork copied into its data fork. Its actual resource fork is empty. Therefore, these files can survive transport across single-fork filesystems. For example, the major Mac OS X theme resource, "extras.rsrc" is such a file, as evidenced by the fact that Mac OS X can boot on the single-fork UFS.

Because of its structure, a .rsrc can be very easily converted back into an old-style EVN plugin but just copying its data fork back into the resource fork. MacOS X makes this very easy - you can address a resource fork by appending /rsrc to whatever file you want to get at. Just run

cp myplugin/rsrc myplugin.rsrc

in the terminal to convert a Mac Plugin to a .rsrc, and

cp myplugin.rsrc myplugin/rsrc

to switch it back. This would be trivial to write a front-end for, and there is also a nice free program called (url="http://"http://webperso.easyconnect.fr/bdesgraupes/Downloads/ToggleFork.hqx")ToggleFork(/url) that will work on any MacOS version, even pre-X.

What seant and I bemoan is that there are subtle differences between .rsrc files and .rez files that make this impossible. Because of differences in the way the x86 and PPC instruction sets operate, the developers at Contraband have decided to reverse the byte order of certain portions of the plug-in file. This makes simple copying back and forth, as above, impossible. To make matters worse, it's perfectly possible to load a .rsrc file on a PC, and then swap the byte order in memory - .rez <-> .rsrc converts have to do this anyway. Essentially, .rez is a bizarrely inconvenient non-shortcut.

Or, in the more succinct words of the Virtual PC development team: "endian little hate we".

-reg

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"As a rule we believe as much as we can. We would believe everything if only we could."
~ William James

(This message has been edited by Regulus (edited 02-11-2004).)