GTW Game 37

Death post time!

Need a scapegoat for terrorism?

Why not Zoidberg?

Also, keep your eyes on mrxak. Hurk, blargh.

<death>

Voting is closed.

Final Vote Tally:

retep998
JacaByte
mrxak
mud212

croc
SoItBegins

mud212
retep998

SoItBegins
Techerakh

retep998 is now dead. Unfortunately, Techerakh is also dead. They were both diplomats.

Remaining players:

croc
JacaByte
mrxak
mud212
SoItBegins

I feel we should heed prophile's advice (and history) by voting out mrxak.

Well, there's up to two more rounds. Let's make these count. The IA is still out there, at least, and hopefully he's managed to investigate two of the remaining people, instead or one or two dead people.

Okay, since the person I most suspect is mud212 and he's voting based on the word of a dead man with no knowledge of the game (and would be cheating to say so after his death, anyway), I guess it's you.

You piled on and voted for nfreader when it was clear nfreader was going to die, anyway. I voted for him in the very beginning, based on what he did to me (and the game in general with his contempt for it) last game. If one of us is a traitor and voted to kill the other one, it was you.

At their latest diplomatic meeting, the diplomats vote that clearly Retep998 must be the traitor. They call the guards, who proceed to grab Retep998 and haul him away. As Retep998 is dragged down the hall, he grabs a grenade from his pocket, yanks off the pin, and swallows the grenade. The guards quickly dive to the ground, and in the last few seconds of Retep998's life he cries out "You fools, I am no traitor. I will not let you incompetent fools be my murderers, so I shall take my own life! The true traitor is...", and in that very moment Retep998's head explodes. The remaining diplomats grab guns and proceed to fill Retep998's decapitated corpse with bullets, mrxak at the forefront of the group in his nice black suit with the green silk tie, pumping Retep998 full of lead with his M249 light machine gun held in one hand, while putting a cigar to his lips with the other. To be continued by Techerakh possibly...

This post has been edited by retep998 : 07 June 2012 - 06:06 PM

I'm curious as to retep998's abilities to scream while a grenade is stuck in this throat.

@mrxak, on 07 June 2012 - 05:35 PM, said in GTW Game 37:

You piled on and voted for nfreader when it was clear nfreader was going to die, anyway.

As I recall, my vote actually broke a three-way tie, thus condemning nfreader.

I have been instructed by my anonymous captor to read the following message to you:

Shortly after retep exploded, as the rest of us were laying waste to his corpse, I felt a sharp pain in my side. I looked down to see my torso being sliced open by an X-Acto knife. Despite reports to the contrary, however, I have not been killed, but simply removed to an unknown location. There is another prisoner blindfolded here with me. I do not know the identity of my captor or of the other prisoner. I don't know why they have taken me, unfortunately, or where we're hidden. Trying to find me would be a waste of resources. I can believe you remaining diplomats will still succeed. Be careful; ignore nothing; victory is still possible. I have just a few moments before they come to kill me.

Good luck, dips. It's been real.

This post has been edited by Techerakh : 07 June 2012 - 06:32 PM

Heh, I was right, Techerakh did get killed. I still think he was a jerkwad.

I know myself to be innocent. If croc is innocent as well that means the traitor voted for his fellow traitor in the first round. I find the odds of this are highly likely, however we should probably work on determining the role of croc. This is very hard to do considering he has only posted once in this entire thread.

What intrigues me is that mrxak only just now thought of mud's bandwagoning on nfreader as reasonable evidence, when last round he didn't "particularly suspect" mud at all. mrxak also hasn't tried to cast any suspicion on myself during this round, when we all know that I deserve suspicion the most after my first round meltdown. If mrxak was interested in the victory of the innocents, I think he'd consider the possibility that any of us are traitors, including myself. For now I think I shall cast my vote for mrxak.

This post has been edited by JacaByte : 08 June 2012 - 09:57 AM

Well you missed me arguing with Techerakh on IRC, trying to convince him that his ruling out mud212 was absolute nonsense. I'm pretty sure I posted similar things here on the forum. I'll try to find and quote that post.

Here it is:

@mrxak, on 06 June 2012 - 06:19 PM, said in GTW Game 37:

Bandwagon? I was the second vote, just minutes after the game began. I would have voted for nfreader no matter what, as revenge for his behavior towards me in game 35, voting for me again and again long after I was dead. The man is a disruption, his grumpiness was showing itself on IRC even before the game started, and he had to die. I'm the only one here with a genuine reason to vote for the guy. I'm glad others chose to do so because we killed a traitor. If one of the others is a traitor, look elsewhere. mud212, for example, voted for nfreader after there was already a plurality against him. Look at yourself, who changed your vote suddenly which created a tie, jeopardizing, among others, prophile.

Maybe not that strong , but I didn't just come up with this. You can count this quote as casting suspicion on you too, this round, if you like.

Problem with that logic is that after I changed my vote from nfreader to Techerakh mud212 could have easily changed his vote to somebody else, namely Techerakh or prophile. If mud212, you or SIB were evil any of you could have changed your votes from nfreader and saved him, at least for that round.

In which case, our only choice for traitor is croc. So what do you say, should we vote out croc?

If voting for croc is what it takes to save my life, I'd consider it. It seems he's unlikely to vote, and Mackilroy has said that anyone not voting two rounds in a row gets killed anyway.

I'd like to ask just what I've done in this game that makes me look so suspicious that I haven't done in every other game I've played? Is it just because two dead guys with no more evidence than anyone else thinks I'm the traitor? Of the votes to kill the last traitor, mine is the least questionable out of those who are left in the game. My frequent and long posts are hardly keeping a low profile either, as the last traitor would want to do when his own death ends the game. I could have hidden the whole time like mud212, making short non-offensive posts.

See that's the thing, you're behaving as though you're innocent like it's a forced act, the thing that you lack is transparency. The fact that the traitors picked off Techerakh instead of you also concerns me, since it's apparent that you have had a large sway in how everybody has voted during this game up to this point. If you were innocent and I were in the traitor's shoes, I'd want to pick off the players who were most likely deduce my role. In GTW 35 I didn't question your innocence, and had we listened to you we would have nabbed both traitors back to back. Sure you nailed nfreader in the first round, but your hunch for retep998 didn't pay off. And who's next? Right now it sounds like mud212 is.

What I'd like to hear is your take on everybody's innocence and treachery, you'll only have to write 4 dossiers so that shouldn't be too difficult at this point.

My take on it:

JacaByte ~ I think he's behaving as normal.
mrxak ~ helped vote out nfreader in Round 1. PROBABLY innocent (mrxak's as hard to read as I remember :hector_bird:)
SiB ~ Uh, I'm innocent.

mud212 ~ Suspicious. Repeatedly last on the bandwagon.
croc ~ Suspicious. Lurking.

I'm not sure who is more suspicious, but I think the last-bandwagon thing is a bit odd. For the time being, I'll vote for mud212.

Let's review.

Day One
SoItBegins voted for nfreader, randomly (1 against nfreader)
mrxak voted for nfreader, for revenge (2 against nfreader)
prophile voted for retep998, presciently in self-defense (1 against retep998)
retep998 voted for prophile, randomly (1 against prophile)
JacaByte voted for nfreader, gave no reason (3 against nfreader)
nfreader voted for prophile, randomly (2 against prophile)
Techerakh voted for JacaByte, randomly (1 against JacaByte)
prophile changed his vote to Techerakh (2 against Techerakh, 0 against retep998)
mud212 voted for nfreader, alleging statistics (4 against nfreader)

At this point, mud212 did not "break a tie" as he has now later claims.

JacaByte changed his vote to Techerakh (3 against Techerakh, 3 against nfreader)

Nor did mud212 post again after JacaByte changed his vote. In fact, it would seem he wasn't even aware that the opportunity presented itself to save nfreader. I, on the other hand, did post, and was aware. I did not, however, choose to change my vote. In fact, prophile msged me on IRC, asking if I'd change my vote to Techerakh to prevent the tie. For some reason he thought he was part of that tie, even though there were just two votes against him. I pointed out to him that if he changed his own vote, before realizing as he did that the tie was between two other people. Of course, this was a private conversation, and you may choose to not believe me. Nonetheless, he did as I suggested.

prophile changed his vote to nfreader (2 against Techerakh, 4 against nfreader)
croc voted for JacaByte, without explanation (2 against JacaByte)

We went into Day Two with two people dead, and nfreader was revealed to be a traitor. The only people to have shown an interest in killing prophile before was a traitor and retep998, so it seemed reasonable to me to suspect him. Not the strongest case, sure, but I also suspected JacaByte for his vote changing and odd behavior. I was aware that the other traitor could have voted out nfreader, but wasn't yet prepared to scrutinize, and focused my attentions on the four people who didn't. After all, the game was young and there was only one traitor left. Not much to go on yet.

Day Two
JacaByte voted for Techerakh, because jerkwad (1 against Techerakh)
JacaByte retracted his vote (0 against Techerakh)
retep998 voted for JacaByte, because jerkwad (1 against JacaByte)
mrxak voted for retep998, because bad guys vote random and retep998 wanted prophile dead (1 against retep998)
JacaByte voted for retep998, because puppetry (2 against retep998)
SoItBegins voted for croc, because process of elimination (1 against croc)
mud212 voted for SoItBegins, randomly (1 against SoItBegins)
Techerakh voted for SoItBegins, randomly (2 against SoItBegins)
JacaByte changed his vote to croc (2 against croc, 1 against retep998)
mrxak changed his vote to croc (3 against croc, 0 against retep998)
mud212 changed his vote to retep998 (1 against retep998, 1 against SoItBegins)
JacaByte changed his vote to retep998 (2 against retep998, 2 against croc)
mrxak changed his vote to retep998 (3 against retep998, 1 against croc)

We went into day three with two more people dead, both innocent, and that's where we are now.

I think the voting record makes a pretty good case for mud212, in both rounds. He's been voting as safely as possible, taking no risks. A vote against somebody with three votes already makes sense if you're a traitor. If it's a good guy, there's lots of blame to go around, and if it's a traitor, better to have voted for your cohort if it's clear he's dead anyway. In the second round, he voted for somebody, saying it was random, and casting no actual blame on SoItBegins at all. SoItBegins and everyone else could easily ignore his vote, and no feathers were ruffled by it. He then changed his vote when it was again safe, knowing two of us would change too, thus plenty of blame to go around when retep998 turned out to be innocent, and erasing any bad blood between him and SoItBegins, who was up on the chopping block. Then, mud212 went and killed Techerakh in the night, who also voted for SoItBegins, which might cast blame on SoItBegins. Since mud212 knew that a traitor voted out nfreader, since he is one, it was best to cast as much blame on the other two people who voted for nfreader. He blamed me, and created evidence that might also point to SoItBegins. He knew I was going to vote for him this round, so he preempted it, using an uninformed dead person as an excuse.

The voting record also makes a case for SoItBegins being the traitor, which is something I just figured out as I wrote this post. SoItBegins voted for his fellow traitor in the very first round, as the very first vote. I have no idea if it's true or not, but it's possible Mackilroy sent out PMs for people with roles first, and thus SoItBegins, as a traitor, was ready to go with his strategy right at the start. He was going to vote against his fellow traitor early, so that if one of them died, they could point at his vote. Perhaps SoItBegins overplayed his hand, and did not expect so many others to vote for him, in turn, but by then, it was too late, there was a clear majority, and if that vote succeeded but SoItBegins changed his vote, it would look suspicious. When opportunity presented itself to save nfreader, when JacaByte changed his vote, SoItBegins wasn't active on the forums. He, unlike I, did not post again after JacaByte's switch. He was probably unaware that there was a chance, and so his cohort died. He did his best to go along with my argument that people who voted for nfreader are more likely to be innocent, and in the second round he voted for croc, an inactive player and a good target to avoid much attention. He only posted once more to make a joke, and then either he did not know people were voting for him, or was waiting for either a tiebreaker run-off or for people like JacaByte, mud212, and I to change votes around to kill somebody else. In the night he killed Techerakh, the one person who gave any indication of suspecting him, as a way of perhaps keeping a low profile going into the final rounds. Having seen my argument against mud212, he figured he made a good target, and two votes for two people other than himself was better than people looking around for other targets.

The voting record also makes a case for JacaByte. He was, after all, the one to abandon his vote against the traitor, and caused a tie vote which might have saved nfreader. It was a self-defense vote, of course, which makes it seemingly justified if we succeeded in killing his cohort. He claimed he would have changed his vote back, if nobody else broke the tie, thus, he could still get in on an nfreader kill if nfreader was going to die (and he certainly did his best to put on the pretense of glaring at nfreader), but if he could convince somebody else to kill Techerakh, his harshest critic to date, all the better. JacaByte's reaction to Techerakh certainly seemed strange at the time, and still does. Why was he so defensive and taking it personally? It would seem as though JacaByte took Techerakh's bait. Then we went into the second day, and sure enough, there ended up a tie. Who did JacaByte want to switch to? croc, which was one of the two people who voted for him the round before. mud212's switch to retep998 triggered a reversal, which saved croc, but in the night, Techerakh, the only other living person to ever vote against JacaByte, was killed. This round, JacaByte is again pushing for croc to die. Apparently he holds a grudge.

croc should probably be considered, seeing as how he's been rather inactive, and it might or might not be a ploy to keep a low profile. He didn't vote at all in the second round, and his first vote seemed random and he gave no justification. Historically we do tend to be suspicious of, and vote for lurkers. I'm not sure that's justified in this case, however.

Okay, so what about mrxak? The best argument I've heard as to why I'm the traitor is that I'm one of the few players good enough to pull it off. That, at least to me, seems kind of cheap. If I'm the traitor and good enough, I deserve to win and probably will. If you vote me out because you think I'm historically a good traitor, then I'm not good enough and your justification for killing me is silly. If I'm innocent, then it's just plain unfair to kill me based on what past hosts have decided to choose for bad guys. Using statistics on past games is like saying a coin is guaranteed to land heads because it landed heads in the last three tosses.

Either way, if you're going to vote me out, at least do me the honor of coming up with a logical, justified reason for doing so. If I'm the traitor and you kill me fairly, based on evidence I left behind, so be it, I've have had fun and maybe learned something. If I'm innocent and you kill me based on an excellent frame-job by the bad guys, so be it, I've had fun and the bad guys are deserving of the win. Anything else just bums me out.

So what evidence is there of my guilt in the voting record? Well, let's see. I voted early and often throughout the entire first round where nfreader, a traitor I voted for and never changed my vote away from, got killed. Of the people who voted to kill him, I'm the only remaining person who voted after JacaByte changed his vote, creating the tie that could have saved nfreader. I could have changed my vote. I could have been justified in changing my vote. I chose not to while the others had the opportunity and (according to the posts in this topic) weren't around to even see it. prophile was killed in the first round. I had no reason to kill him. He had already msged me asking for a favor, to change my vote and prevent the tie he mistakenly believed would kill him. Apparently he trusted me, and if I was evil I might have been able to manipulate him with that trust. If he revealed his role too, I could have encouraged him to kill an innocent. Of course this was in IRC msgs, and you may not believe it, but what I know to be true is he msged me, and I urged him to vote out nfreader with me, which is what he did. Whether or not you believe those msgs really happened, it doesn't matter. Logically, if he didn't trust me, I wouldn't know he had a role that could potentially harm me. If he did trust me, I could have used his role against innocents. Instead, he died in the first night, apparently revenge from nfreader's cohort, since it was prophile's vote that doomed the first traitor. That's not a decision I would have made if I knew his role, and if I didn't know his role, I had no reason to kill him that any other traitor wouldn't have shared. Looking at things objectively, does anyone here honestly believe I'm the likeliest traitor, based on the first round?

So the second day came along, and I argued that people who voted for nfreader were probably innocent, as I knew myself to be. Looking over how people posted and voted, I thought Techerakh and croc were behaving strangely, and that retep998 and JacaByte were the most likely suspects. I pushed for, and succeeded, in voting out one of those two people. In the night, somebody I quarreled with a bit, but who ultimately voted for SoItBegins, was killed. Now, to be perfectly honest, if I was a traitor, that might be something I would do, though I hadn't really thought about it. When the news came down that Techerakh was killed, I immediately thought I was being framed. Looking at the voting record though, it seems just as likely that SoItBegins was being framed. That's perhaps even the more obvious choice, since Techerakh actually voted for him. The remaining players here, let's be honest, are fairly new to the game. SoItBegins and I go way back, and if one of us was being framed, the other three players might fall for it. On the other hand, it could be SoItBegins or I eliminating a threat. Either you think that it was a frame job by either mud212 or JacaByte, or it was really SoItBegins or I. Or it was JacaByte being framed. Or JacaByte eliminating a threat. Or it was somebody random killing somebody random. We probably won't know the truth until the game is over and we see who the real traitor is.

When it comes down to it. I think there's three good candidates for who the traitor is, one probably inactive player who may in fact be a bad guy staying quiet to go unnoticed, and me, the guy who has one bit of evidence against him that applies just as easily to everyone else.

That's my take. It's a good thing nfreader isn't still in the game, because posting something that long would guarantee he votes me out this round :p. As the only living player who clearly had the opportunity to save nfreader and chose not to, I'd like to say that I'm especially glad he's dead, and honestly have no regrets.

Well one thing I notice about mud is that he's consist about not knowing who the other traitors may be, besides the fact that "nfreader and mrxak are statistically the most likely to be evil." And that's all he's said on the subject of who may/may not be evil, and you're right, so far all his votes have served to bandwagon on another player. So to elicit a further response from mud212 , I shall vote for him.

This post has been edited by JacaByte : 08 June 2012 - 11:48 AM

(mrxak)

Oh also sorry I don't have TEN THOUSAND posts like the rest of you guys,

I can only say it so many times, playing this game on a forum is a waste of time

Well, it would seem I'm to be voted out of the game. Then again, I had a sneaking suspicion that I was going to be assassinated at the end of this round, anyway.

Allow me, then, a final few words to try and clear my name.

First, I voted against nfreader the first time I logged into the forums to play in this game. If I voted fourth, then I did so purely as a matter of timing, not of cold calculation (which is really more mrxak's forte).

In the second round, I chose to change my vote to protect a player I knew to be innocent and move against a player I had suspected of being a traitor. I fear, though, that this move has ensured my exit from the game, one way or the other.

I know this won't sway any of you, particularly in the face of mrxak's rather long-winded (and tedious) defense of himself. I know full well his power to mold the truth to his whims, launching long diatribes to create uncertainty where there is none, to obscure facts that seemed so clear only moments before. So I will leave you this for posterity, so that once you've hung me by the neck and you come to know me, we shall see if mrxak can make the facts dance to his tune once again:

Croc and SoItBegins are innocent.

By process of elimination mrxak is the traitor, given that I, croc and SIB are innocent and mud is the IA.

But if you know that SIB is innocent, why don't you contact him via PM and tell him you know he's innocent and what your role is? You would have had 3 votes between yourself, SIB and croc, and then it wouldn't matter who myself and mrxak voted for and you wouldn't have to spill your identity.

But. If we kill mrxak and it turns out he's not the traitor you've painted a pretty picture for myself, in which case I can only conclude that you're the traitor. Assuming I'm alive next round, of course.

This post has been edited by JacaByte : 08 June 2012 - 01:37 PM