I want to talk treasures and rewards. When you explore the POG map you open probably 250, maybe more, of the unguarded treasure cairns and pits. And at various points you reach guarded treasures in chests and bags, either in caves or near campfires guarded by various nasty persons.
These treasures all have about the same value, a handful of 0-25 coins. In the guarded treasures, maybe occasionally a cheap weapon or a chunk of cheese.
The result is that treasure-finding soon becomes monotonous. You have to keep opening these things because one might contain something important for the game. But in fact they never do, only the same little handful of coins, and it gets old pretty fast.
The unguarded pits and cairns seem to yield coins based on a uniform random distribution between 0 and about 25. In a uniform distribution, you are as likely to get 0 coins as 7, 15, or 19 coins.
In my opinion, the game would be much more fun if these unguarded treasures were based on a non-uniform random distribution over a much wider range. Say, an exponential distribution between 0 and 1000, so you are equally likely to 0 coins, 10 coins, 100 coins, or 1000. This greater randomness would add a lot to the fun of tramping over terrain.
The guarded treasures are more lame still. After I'd cleaned out the Troll's nest and killed the last troll I got "an iron key" so I could open the trolls' locked chests. I really expected to find something of value. Nunh-uh. Those chests had the same boring few coins in each. Similar disappointment when you work hard to clear out a cavern full of cobwebs and ghouls, and way at the back is a treasure chest, and in the chest is ... 12 coins and a bunch of grapes ?!? (At least a cobwebby chest should contain "raisins" not "grapes"!)
In my opinion, a guarded treasure should always turn out to be something worth guarding! Decent armor or weapons, and/or sizeable amounts of cash (up to several thousand coins). Or gems or jewelry you could exchange for weapons. In any event, something worth the effort of reaching it! And again, such values should be on a highly nonlinear distribution, so the next chest or bag you pillage is not always a replay of the last one.
Hope these are helpful suggestions to designers...
Yeah, that's a cool idea.
See the FireStain
While I think that most of what you say is true there are a few things I'd like to point out: Firstly, not all treasure chests contain the same old pile of coins and food. What about the chests that contain the Elven Bow of Destruction or the War Axe Misery? Secondly, the amount of money you get does vary from chest to chest, mostly because of luck. It's not as if the amount you get doesn't increase over time. And finally, the random chests, rock piles and holes do sometimes give other items purely by chance. Occasionally you can even find Elixirs that permanently increase your attributes in them. I'm not disagreeing with you, but I'm just saying that they don't just give small piles of coins.
That is a good idea, but when coldstone comes out you can make modifications to your games without making ambrosia destroy the challenge of the game for charachters other than the ranger.
'This My Friend Is A Pint' Meriadoc Brandywine
Originally posted by Thjud:
**I want to talk treasures and rewards. When you explore the POG map you open probably 250, maybe more, of the unguarded treasure cairns and pits. And at various points you reach guarded treasures in chests and bags, either in caves or near campfires guarded by various nasty persons.
Hope these are helpful suggestions to designers...
Just to add a few minor comments, as Kelsan has done a fairly decent response previous to mine:
1. The Iron Key you mention is dropped by a Cyclops I believe, not a troll as you indicate. Also, your luck stat must have been really low when you opened the chests. When I have opened them, they tend to give anywhere from 125 to 250 pieces of gold each. Of course my luck stat tends to be at least 15 or slightly higher each time.
2. You idea of 'Guarded' chests giving more is valid but there are several places in the game where this exists already. (Kelsan mentioned a few) and also the Elven full plate armor is found in a chest in a cave guarded heavily by zombies and death knights or revenants, (think that's their name/type). In addition, there are at least two other caves or crypts where chests contain rings of Unicorn and one with a ring of titan. Each are heavily defended by various monsters.)
3. The key to getting more gold and better items from chests, rock piles, holes and even from monsters you kill is your luck stat it seems. The higher it is, the better items/money reward you get. The game provides several ways for this to happen: if you are lucky, you uncover potions of luck in rockpiles and holes; The cyclops eye quest gives you an elixir of luck if you complete it; In the same cave with the Elven Full plate armor is an elixir of luck along with an elixir of strength; Or, the old standby of course, is to buy elixirs of luck from the Witch Kalixa (sp?).
4. My only real complaint is with Sea Giants. It is my view that even at low luck stat levels, if you manage to kill a sea giant, you should be rewarded with more than a measly 47 pieces of gold or zip/nada as sometimes happens. Sure, the big thrill is that you actually manage to defeat one, but while applause is nice, money is better. Again however, even with Sea Giants, once you build your luck stat up to above 30, the rings start falling fairly regularly along with various elixirs. The gold drop increases into the hundreds also. Also, to be fair, I must admit that even when my luck stat is only around 25, if I clear the screen around Gidolan Keep of all Sea Giants, I usually manage to get at least two rings of some kind and every once in a while even a Ring of the Gods.
5. Even your suggestion about finding a chest containing thousands of gold pieces exists in the game as it is. The one I have located several times during game play is in a screen down south (I think it is one screen north of the southern tunnel) but its not that heavily guarded, maybe one giant on the screen at any given moment and a few of the grey boulder throwing guys. It's location is marked by the secret circled S symbol. Another one can be found in the screen on the south side of Gidolan keep. It also gives several thousand pieces of gold along with an elixir of dexterity each time I have opened it. My Luck stat is usually around 40-50 or higher when I do this so I suspect the amount will depend on your exact luck stat.
While I agree that there may be room for a little more variation in the amount and types of items that are discovered, the current game does provide some ways to deal with some of your complaints, and then other things that you mentioned as being lacking, do in fact exist in the game as it is. But hey, when Coldstone is released, if you feel up to it, add some of your ideas into a plug and post it on the add-ons page, or perhaps some other designer will.